Formula1 Talk

[MadManCK]

The good news for Honda is that they have swallowed their pride and teamed up with Ilmor. They were responsible for the McLaren Mercedes V10 and other F1 projects in the past and will give Honda the badly needed boost to succeed their project. This also implies that Mclaren will most likely continue their relationship with Honda and even Alonso might stay for another year. Nothing has been signed yet though.

Lots of rumors about the silly season.

Renault will most likely replace Palmer with Kubica next year. Epic come back that one.
Toro Rosso has had a peptalk from the RBR Boss Helmut Markko, as they underperform in his eyes and might give Gasly a drive next year. Sainz will stay, but Kvyatt has the Russian connections at work. Nothing decided there either. But it would surprise me if they would not give a new driver a change. After all that is the core function of Toro Rosso.

Vettel has signed a new deal at Ferrari until 2020. He wanted only a 1 year deal, so the Italians must have been very convincing.
Rumored salary of over 40M $ a year with bonuses.

Sauber will most likely extend Ericsson and give Monegasque top talent and Ferrari prodigy LeClerc the other seat. Part of the extended Ferrari engine deal and they will get the latest spec engine, just as HAAS gets.

Williams has still 2 unconfirmed seats for next year. Massa has already stated that he might consider another year, but i think someone else might take that spot. Stroll will most likely stay with the massive sponsor budget he brings.

Force One (India) still has to confirm Perez, but they would be fools not to keep him there.

Mercedes still has not sealed the deal with Bottas. A bit strange as they more or less confirmed his seat for next year. Having the Mercedes team boss Toto Wolff as your manager can become tricky in this case.

And there are rumors of new teams and engine suppliers showing some interest in Formula 1. But i think they will step in after next rule changes.

So far Raikkonen is the man to beat at SPA this weekend.

First free practice results - 2017 Belgian Formula 1 Grand Prix

Pos. Driver Team Time Laps
1. K. Raikkonen Ferrari 01:45.502 13
2. L. Hamilton Mercedes 01:45.555 19
3. S. Vettel Ferrari 01:45.647 13
4. M. Verstappen Red Bull 01:46.302 18
5. D. Ricciardo Red Bull 01:46.352 22
6. V. Bottas Mercedes 01:46.424 20
7. C. Sainz Jr. Toro Rosso 01:47.446 22
8. E. Ocon Force India 01:47.670 27
9. D. Kvyat Toro Rosso 01:47.851 20
10. S. Vandoorne McLaren 01:47.865 18
11. J. Palmer Renault 01:47.930 14
12. N. Hulkenberg Renault 01:48.037 15
13. F. Alonso McLaren 01:48.252 18
14. S. Pérez Force India 01:48.452 19
15. L. Stroll Williams 01:48.541 24
16. K. Magnussen Haas 01:48.615 20
17. R. Grosjean Haas 01:48.626 20
18. M. Ericsson Sauber 01:50.160 21
19. P. Wehrlein Sauber 01:51.263 13
20. F. Massa Williams no time 3


Second free practice results - 2017 Belgian Formula 1 Grand Prix

Pos. Driver Team Time Laps
1. L. Hamilton Mercedes 01:44.753 17
2. K. Raikkonen Ferrari 01:45.015 21
3. V. Bottas Mercedes 01:45.180 17
4. M. Verstappen Red Bull 01:45.225 16
5. S. Vettel Ferrari 01:45.235 20
6. D. Ricciardo Red Bull 01:46.072 15
7. N. Hulkenberg Renault 01:46.441 24
8. E. Ocon Force India 01:46.473 19
9. C. Sainz Jr. Toro Rosso 01:46.561 19
10. J. Palmer Renault 01:46.670 23
11. F. Alonso McLaren 01:46.743 20
12. S. Pérez Force India 01:46.984 18
13. R. Grosjean Haas 01:47.285 15
14. S. Vandoorne McLaren 01:47.303 17
15. D. Kvyat Toro Rosso 01:47.450 12
16. K. Magnussen Haas 01:47.556 15
17. L. Stroll Williams 01:47.861 13
18. M. Ericsson Sauber 01:49.214 12
19. P. Wehrlein Sauber 01:49.725 18


Third free practice results - 2017 Belgian Formula 1 Grand Prix

Pos. Driver Team Time Laps
1. K. Raikkonen Ferrari 01:43.916 17
2. S. Vettel Ferrari 01:44.113 15
3. L. Hamilton Mercedes 01:44.114 11
4. M. Verstappen Red Bull 01:45.034 13
5. V. Bottas Mercedes 01:45.230 18
6. D. Ricciardo Red Bull 01:45.286 18
7. J. Palmer Renault 01:45.491 11
8. S. Pérez Force India 01:45.857 14
9. C. Sainz Jr. Toro Rosso 01:45.942 18
10. F. Alonso McLaren 01:46.060 12
11. N. Hulkenberg Renault 01:46.064 11
12. E. Ocon Force India 01:46.179 14
13. R. Grosjean Haas 01:46.196 14
14. S. Vandoorne McLaren 01:46.300 14
15. L. Stroll Williams 01:46.620 18
16. F. Massa Williams 01:46.667 22
17. K. Magnussen Haas 01:46.690 13
18. D. Kvyat Toro Rosso 01:47.903 7
19. P. Wehrlein Sauber 01:48.296 17
20. M. Ericsson Sauber 01:48.300 6

[MadManCK]

A real thriller with a historic outcome. Hamilton equals Schumacher with 68 pole positions

Vettel almost made it with an epic last section. With both title rivals at the first row, all ingredients are there for an epic race on Sunday. Some rain might spice things up as well, as Spa remains unpredictable.


Qualifying results - 2017 Belgian Formula 1 Grand Prix

Pos. Driver Team Q1 Q2 Q3 Laps
1. L. Hamilton Mercedes 01:44.184 01:42.927 01:42.553 17
2. S. Vettel Ferrari 01:44.275 01:43.987 01:42.795 12
3. V. Bottas Mercedes 01:44.773 01:43.249 01:43.094 18
4. K. Raikkonen Ferrari 01:44.729 01:43.700 01:43.270 11
5. M. Verstappen Red Bull 01:44.535 01:43.940 01:43.380 12
6. D. Ricciardo Red Bull 01:45.114 01:44.224 01:43.863 12
7. N. Hulkenberg Renault 01:45.280 01:44.988 01:44.982 15
8. S. Pérez Force India 01:45.591 01:44.894 01:45.244 14
9. E. Ocon Force India 01:45.277 01:45.006 01:45.369 14
10. J. Palmer Renault 01:45.447 01:44.843 10

11. F. Alonso McLaren 01:45.668 01:45.090 11
12. R. Grosjean Haas 01:45.728 01:45.133 12
13. K. Magnussen Haas 01:45.535 01:45.400 12
14. C. Sainz Jr. Toro Rosso 01:45.374 01:45.439 12
15. S. Vandoorne McLaren 01:45.441 11

16. F. Massa Williams 01:45.823 7
17. D. Kvyat Toro Rosso 01:46.028 6
18. L. Stroll Williams 01:46.915 5
19. M. Ericsson Sauber 01:47.214 6
20. P. Wehrlein Sauber 01:47.679 6

[MadManCK]

A good battle at the front, but nothing more than that. I never had the feeling Vettel had a real chance and Hamilton did control the race, even set a very fast last lap. Ricciardo won another lottery, when Kimi made a silly mistake, ignoring a yellow flag and Bottas was sandwiched big time by both of them. Best overtake of the race.

The race really came to life after the safety car was deployed, a result from hot headed Force India drivers who gave each other not enough room. In this case Perez was to blame for two similar accidents, where he tried to drive his team mate into the wall.

What i really can not believe, is that the FIA did not give any penalty for a very dangerous situation. That makes me question the sanity of the race stewards. If they had collided slightly different, a serious accident could have happened easily there.
Just another example of bad judgement from the race directors.

Max' engine failed again and this can and will not continue like that. I would invite Niki Lauda for a cup of Italian Espresso in Monza.

RBR is in talks with Porsche for an engine deal after 2019, so is Williams. But that might be too late to keep Max for the team.

The chair dance is full in play now with many drivers on the verge of signing a new deal, like Perez and Bottas. Alonso might be the key. Or even Verstappen. Upcoming weeks will be very interesting in that regard.

Ferrari keeps Vettel and Raikkonen for next year. So the second Mercedes seat is the hot seat right now. Alonso, Verstappen or still Bottas? Bottas might be sent back to Williams to replace Massa. It would not surprise me.





Race results - 2017 Belgian Formula 1 Grand Prix

Pos. Driver Team Time
1. L. Hamilton Mercedes 1:24:42.820
2. S. Vettel Ferrari +2.358
3. D. Ricciardo Red Bull +10.791 +8.433
4. K. Raikkonen Ferrari +14.471 +3.680
5. V. Bottas Mercedes +16.456 +1.985
6. N. Hulkenberg Renault +28.087 +11.631
7. R. Grosjean Haas +1 lap
8. F. Massa Williams + 1 lap
9. E. Ocon Force India + 1 lap
10. C. Sainz Jr. Toro Rosso + 1 lap
11. L. Stroll Williams + 1 lap
12. D. Kvyat Toro Rosso + 1 lap
13. J. Palmer Renault + 1 lap
14. S. Vandoorne McLaren + 1 lap
15. M. Ericsson Sauber + 1 lap
16. K. Magnussen Haas + 1 lap
17. S. Pérez Force India +2 Laps
Did not finish
18. F. Alonso McLaren +19 Laps
19. M. Verstappen Red Bull +37 Laps
20. P. Wehrlein Sauber +42 Laps

[MadManCK]

Kimi and Perez both received penalty points on their license. Kimi for ignoring the yellow flag and Perez for cutting the track and gaining an advantage. But not for his double attempts to push his team mate into the walls.
Perez missed his braking point after a double toe, but was already way ahead of the two cars he passed, before he cut the track. IMO not really gaining an advantage.
The FIA prove to be pencil pushers over and over again. They act strong and fierce on rule enforcing, but at the same time turn a blind eye on dangerous driver behavior.

Force India did see what happened, just like millions of TV viewers and has taken action. Ocon and Perez will no longer allowed to race each other. They already did get a warning. Previous incidents at Baku and Canada did cost them points. From a team perspective the logical choice. But bad for racing. I wonder if Perez will get trouble extending his contract. He is supposed to be the mature driver of the two. Maybe he can't stand Ocon overtaking him. Usually Perez is a tough but fair driver.

Renault was to blame this weekend for a lot of issues. Kvyatt had to replace a complete power train and Palmer and Verstappen got a new combustion engine. In addition to that, Verstappens engine failed after just 8 laps in the race. Leaving a frustrated driver, Red Bull Team and disappointed fans behind. They still don't do enough obviously.

Even Alain Prost came to Verstappen end RBR to apologise for the Renault engine fail.
Nice gesture from the 3 times World Champion. But that should not be needed.

There are conspiracy theories floating around the web now about Verstappen being sabotaged. I would not go "David Icke" on Renault yet, but why does Ricciardo not have the same issues? Are his mechanics that much better or more focused? Or is the Sainz family throwing sugar lumps in Verstappens fuel tank? Question remains who will benefit most from Verstappens fail strike. This much "bad luck" is unnatural.
Maybe Christian Horner needs to hold an internal investigation. Something is not right there.

https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/horn ... ontent=www



EDIT; Renault has officially apologized to RBR, Max and the fans. They will also work together with RBR to get to the bottom of what hapened at Spa. Maybe something good can come from it, who knows.
Perez has apologised to Ocon, who has apologized for the "he wants to kill me statement". All in the heat of the moment.

Lots of apologies...

[MadManCK]

Fortunately i'm not the only one, finding it ridiculous that Perez was not penalized for his actions against his team mate Ocon. Former F1 World Champion Jaques Villeneuve is known for his unfiltered comments.

https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/vill ... ontent=www

Villeneuve was surprised the stewards did not to take any action against Perez.

“This is the most dangerous thing you can do in racing"

I'm glad someone does pay attention, but it should have been the stewards.

[MadManCK]

FIA Humor?

[MadManCK]

Mercedes, Ferrari, Red Bull Racing, Force India.
Old news.

Edit; in P2, 3 out of 6 Renault engines had technical issues. They even tried to camouflage Nico Hulkenbergs engine fail with calling it a "problem at the rear of the car". Carlos' engine turned into a smoke machine and Kvyatt was brought in to prevent more issues.
It appear the Renault problems are a lot bigger than they want to communicate.
Last race engine fails and Singapore anticipation will cost Max 15 places and Ricciardo 20 in Monza. Sainz had to change parts as well, dropping him 10 places on the grid. All Renault engines.

It has also become clear that Renaults fail safe software was responsible for Max' engine shutting down at Spa.
I say let him blow up that engine.

Renault is wasting time, money and energy on software tricks to prevent engine damage, instead on more power and reliability. Max has requested them to remove that BS from his engine. Even if he understands bad publicity due to engine blow ups. But what is worst? An engine that fails to work after 8 laps because of a fail-safe mode kicks in, or a blow up due to an engine pushed towards its limits.

I really do hope that Renault can find what is causing all their engines to fail. if they continue like this, even Honda appears to be more reliable.




First free practice results - 2017 Italian Formula 1 Grand Prix

Pos. Driver Team Time Laps
1. L. Hamilton Mercedes 01:21.537 28
2. V. Bottas Mercedes 01:21.972 31
3. S. Vettel Ferrari 01:22.652 24
4. K. Räikkönen Ferrari 01:22.689 28
5. D. Ricciardo Red Bull 01:22.742 28
6. M. Verstappen Red Bull 01:22.749 23
7. S. Pérez Force India 01:23.317 36
8. E. Ocon Force India 01:23.400 34
9. S. Vandoorne McLaren 01:23.465 24
10. F. Massa Williams 01:23.561 37
11. C. Sainz Jr. Toro Rosso 01:23.680 22
12. K. Magnussen Haas 01:23.973 22
13. L. Stroll Williams 01:23.991 30
14. D. Kvyat Toro Rosso 01:24.012 27
15. F. Alonso McLaren 01:24.015 17
16. R. Grosjean Haas 01:24.079 22
17. N. Hulkenberg Renault 01:24.542 17
18. J. Palmer Renault 01:25.166 21
19. P. Wehrlein Sauber 01:25.223 26
20. M. Ericsson Sauber 01:25.687 17

Second free practice results - 2017 Italian Formula 1 Grand Prix

Pos. Driver Team Time Laps
1. V. Bottas Mercedes 01:21.406 25
2. L. Hamilton Mercedes 01:21.462 24
3. S. Vettel Ferrari 01:21.546 33
4. K. Räikkönen Ferrari 01:21.804 34
5. M. Verstappen Red Bull 01:22.409 34
6. D. Ricciardo Red Bull 01:22.752 22
7. S. Vandoorne McLaren 01:22.947 31
8. F. Alonso McLaren 01:22.968 31
9. E. Ocon Force India 01:22.977 43
10. F. Massa Williams 01:22.985 42
11. C. Sainz Jr. Toro Rosso 01:23.150 21
12. N. Hulkenberg Renault 01:23.272 14
13. J. Palmer Renault 01:23.317 34
14. S. Pérez Force India 01:23.352 43
15. L. Stroll Williams 01:23.403 36
16. R. Grosjean Haas 01:23.567 31
17. K. Magnussen Haas 01:23.650 20
18. D. Kvyat Toro Rosso 01:24.253 28
19. M. Ericsson Sauber 01:24.894 39
20. P. Wehrlein Sauber 01:25.295 25

[MadManCK]

P3 was more like a water ballet. More tracktime for the safety car than the F1 cars says enough.
Only at the very end of the session some cars did a wet lap, but all very careful.
Qualifying will probably be dry again and no rain is predicted on Sunday.

[MadManCK]

Qualifying was postponed due to heavy rain. But in the end it was worth the wait.
Lewis Hamilton took another pole at the very last moment. Another record for him.
Red Bull did very well with Max second and Daniel third. Too bad they have these ridiculous grid penalties to deal with. But the qualifying result stands.

This also means that Lance Stroll will start from first row tomorrow.

Ferrari disappointed with their nonflexible strategy. As more rain poured down, they stayed in the pit box too long, robbing themselves from the opportunity to set an early lap time. And they made mistakes with Kimi, almost crashing into a Force India with a burning brake disc. Pasta panic

Ocon did very well also, outclassing his team mate and starting from third spot on the grid tomorrow.

A bit of rain can stir things up.

Predictions are dry weather for tomorrows race.
As qualifying was on wet and intermediate tires, everybody can choose freely what tires to use at the start of the race.

Qualifying results - 2017 Italian Formula 1 Grand Prix

Pos. Driver Team Q1 Q2 Q3 Laps
1. L. Hamilton Mercedes 01:36.009 01:34.660 01:35.554 29
2. M. Verstappen Red Bull 01:37.344 01:36.113 01:36.702 29
3. D. Ricciardo Red Bull 01:38.304 01:37.313 01:36.841 26
4. L. Stroll Williams 01:37.653 01:37.002 01:37.032 27
5. E. Ocon Force India 01:38.775 01:37.580 01:37.719 29
6. V. Bottas Mercedes 01:35.716 01:35.396 01:37.833 29
7. K. Räikkönen Ferrari 01:38.235 01:37.031 01:37.987 30
8. S. Vettel Ferrari 01:37.198 01:36.223 01:38.064 28
9. F. Massa Williams 01:38.338 01:37.456 01:38.251 27
10. S. Vandoorne McLaren 01:38.767 01:37.471 01:39.157 25

11. S. Pérez Force India 01:38.511 01:37.582 19
12. N. Hulkenberg Renault 01:39.242 01:38.059 20
13. F. Alonso McLaren 01:39.134 01:38.202 11
14. D. Kvyat Toro Rosso 01:39.183 01:38.245 21
15. C. Sainz Jr. Toro Rosso 01:39.788 01:38.526 21

16. K. Magnussen Haas 01:40.489 12
17. J. Palmer Renault 01:40.646 10
18. M. Ericsson Sauber 01:41.732 11
19. P. Wehrlein Sauber 01:41.875 9
20. R. Grosjean Haas 01:43.355 3

[MadManCK]

Hamilton takes the lead in the F1 World Championship again. A big slap in the face of the 70 anniversary celebrating scuderia. Vettel did drive to 3rd. But Ricciardo was driver of the day with 4th place, after starting from the back of the grid.

The TV director of this race really did a bad job. Showing Hamilton driving alone a lot. Not much excitement there. Maybe Mercedes has been complaining again about little TV time. There were many interesting battles on the track. Especially in the midfield. Most were missed by the coverage.

Alonso showed his worst side by pushing Palmer off track and afterwards complaining about Palmer cutting the track. It lead to a 5 sec penalty for Palmer, who later had to retire. Alonso called that "Karma", but later had to retire as well. Karma?

Ocon and Stroll had very good races. After the qualifying bonus they did give a good show.

Kimi got a "B" car again from Ferrari. Just ridiculous that a team, who spends 500M a Year, can not provide 2 competitive cars.
On the other hand, Vettel appears to have had some technical issues as well. Preventing him to close the gap to Mercedes.

Max ruined his race by being impatient with Phelipe Massa. No presents there and that collision caused a flat tire and the end of any chance of a good race. Massa did not get a penalty for the collision that was called a racing accident. After the race Massa commented that Max should have been more patient and try it again later. I think he is right there. Still a dick move from Massa.
Verstappen had a few more close calls. Grosjean really sounds like a cry baby sometimes. Probably still suffering from braking issues and blaming everybody else for his mistakes. He did hit Verstappen. Magnussen was another hard nut to crack. But his complaints were pointless, as Max car was already in front of him and he should have backed off. Just like Max should have let Massa go in the chicane. Maybe some will learn from their mistakes. Stewards did not even investigate the Magnussen "incident", as there was none.

Both Saubers are starting to act as driving chicanes. The speed difference to other teams has become too big now. Previous team principal Kaltenborn has really almost killed that team. With new management and a Ferrari factory spec engine next year, they might be a lot quicker.

The engine problems for Honda and Renault were there again. But now they chose only to mention technical issues. To prevent the imago being damaged?

The Toro Rosso deadline will be at 18.00 today. If Honda wants to supply Toro Rosso engines and possibly take an option to buy the team has to be done today.

IMO McLaren are fools if they let Honda leave now.

With Mario Illien assisting the Honda F1 project, results will come sooner or later. And Renault has bigger reliability problems than any engine supplier on the grid now.

Guenther Steiner, HAAS team manager, has said that if you leave out the 3 top teams, the season would have been much more exciting. He might be right. Maybe time to catch up with the big boys.

Race results - 2017 Italian Formula 1 Grand Prix

Pos. Driver Team Time
1. L. Hamilton Mercedes 1:15:32.310
2. V. Bottas Mercedes +4.471
3. S. Vettel Ferrari +36.317 +31.846
4. D. Ricciardo Red Bull +40.335 +4.018
5. K. Räikkönen Ferrari +1:00.082 +19.747
6. E. Ocon Force India +1:11.528 +11.446
7. L. Stroll Williams +1:14.156 +2.628
8. F. Massa Williams +1:14.834 +0.678
9. S. Pérez Force India +1:15.276 +0.442
10. M. Verstappen Red Bull +1 Lap
11. K. Magnussen Haas +1 Lap
12. D. Kvyat Toro Rosso +1 Lap
13. N. Hulkenberg Renault +1 Lap
14. C. Sainz Jr. Toro Rosso +1 Lap
15. R. Grosjean Haas +1 Lap
16. P. Wehrlein Sauber +2 Laps
17. F. Alonso McLaren +3 Laps
18. M. Ericsson Sauber +4 Laps

Did not finish
19. S. Vandoorne McLaren +20 Laps
20. J. Palmer Renault +24 Laps